Car Chat Podcast with Amy & Jamy
Join Amy & Jamy as they chat in Amy's car (the glorious and overtly common white Nissan Pathfinder) each month and chat about one woman of the Bible. Women need other women. We just LOVE that God includes the lives of real, broken women in the Bible and reveals how he loves, interacts, and redeems them. We are excited to surround ourselves with this community of women and be encouraged as we lean into Jesus. You don’t have to remain alone in your faith even when no one is around.
Car Chat Podcast with Amy & Jamy
BONUS: What happened in between the Old & New Testament?
**just for you**
Old Testament Women of the Bible: Discussion Guide Booklet
FREE to download and print: covers all 18 Old Testament women we discussed with the discussion questions for each episode
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Don't miss this BONUS episode!!! It:
- looks BACK to a favorite Old Testament woman*,
- looks FORWARD to the New Testament,
- and lingers a bit in the IN BETWEEN- that space between the Old and New Testament that sets important historical and political context to the Jewish people when Jesus enters the scene.
After the book of Malachi and before Matthew, there were about 400 years without any prophecy or word from God. It's call the Intertestamental Period or 400 Years of Silence.
There were a lot of political, cultural, and religious impacts on the Jewish people. 400 is a long time! Think about it...American has been around for almost 250 years. It's mind-blowing to quantify all the religious, political, and cultural changes that has happened within our history.
We will highlight the impacts these changes had on the women in Jesus' day and how it perfectly sets the stage for the arrival of Jesus to heal, rescue, and save.
It's a great conversation...one that surprised me with a new "ah-ha" moment. Just love how God works!!!
We pray it encourages you right where you are!
A few things we mentioned:
On Getting Out of Bed by Alan Noble
Episode 7: Sarah
Let's stay connect:
IG: @amyruthpetersen
@jamyfisher
produced by: 4110 Ministries, LLC
Well, hey everybody, welcome to Car Chat Podcast. I'm Amy, I'm Jamie, and each month we chat in my car about a woman of the Bible, and today is a really special episode. It is a bonus episode that we are releasing in the in-between as we pivot from our 18 Old Testament. Ladies, that took us how long.
Speaker 2:Two years, yeah, so we're moving from the Old Testament.
Speaker 1:girls, finally, y'all, and they were so good and we're going to talk about that in just a minute, but this episode is the in-between period between the Old Testament and the New Testament, as we literally are pivoting from our Old Testament ladies to our New Testament ladies, and we have 18 New Testament ladies already planned out and their scripture texts and stuff for y'all today to continue this journey. Yes, yes, before we move there, let's kind of look back on the Old Testament ladies and and it's been such a fun journey and, jamie, as you think, back of all those ladies that we did over two years what is something that you or someone that you were encouraged by.
Speaker 2:Well, this might surprise you, because my favorite is Deborah and Eve, but the one that I would say encouraged me the most, especially in light of the podcast conversations you and I have had you'll be surprised is Sarah.
Speaker 1:What I know because you know she wasn't Because she was on your top of not like list, but I'm telling you, just talking with you, revisiting her story, the way that that particular podcast rolled out in our conversation.
Speaker 2:It was one of the most encouraging to me and I think, looking back over her, I looked at it recently because I was trying to find something that I remembered from that time and realized that part of why, specifically, it was so encouraging is a big part of Sarah's story is about waiting. It's about embracing obedience to God and the detours and not the destination, and that the time that we recorded that and not knowing, not having no idea that this year would have a lot of detours as well.
Speaker 2:Just how I'm. So I was so encouraged to remember one of the points you give the three points each time, and one of the things we talked about with Sarah that she was imperfect, yet she was remembered as faithful. And when I very first studied her years ago that was it I thought okay, I don't like her, but God remembers her as the most faithful one. So, huh, what does that really tell me In my most imperfect days, if they were all recorded for people, generations and generations, to hear that God still could remember me as faithful because I walked with him during those waiting times, during those seasons. So I don't know, staying close to him, the other lessons that we've learned along the way she's she has, especially in light of the podcast and I think even some of the feedback that we've gotten about her our podcast that day, she really talking about her that day really, really encouraged me and that has stuck.
Speaker 1:The way that God has included these women in his word and how his Holy Spirit embodies his word and continues to speak.
Speaker 1:However, just within what you remembered and said, I had an aha moment and I want to share it because I mean, that was really significant for me because and I know we talked about this in our episode, but it's landing on me different today where we can, in our brains, remember all the things that we did that was unfaithful, we can have this, the timeline of all the wrongdoings, and often live within or under that, that badge of shame in remembering the bad, remembering the unfaithful, and not taking into account God's grace and redemption and love for us. Despite all those things, yes and to to. To be able to shift my thinking to oh, I just failed at this and I didn't do this well, and I wish I would have done this better to take on the eyes of the Lord and fall underneath the way that he sees me and to remember those times as he remembers me as faithful in my brokenness, absolutely. I mean, that's a game changer in moving forward.
Speaker 2:It's what gives us the courage to come out of seasons of disobedience or unbelief that that may or may not be. It might just be kind of a stuckness that we aren't trusting well, because Sarah didn't just have days of disobedience, she had seasons of it, but over the course of a lifetime. Our lifetimes aren't decided by our bad seasons.
Speaker 1:And that's that's something really important. Our lifetimes are not defined by our bad seasons.
Speaker 2:And and to to know that that God, that God is remembering that not just the bad, but he's hopeful and casting vision for what he knows we are. That that gives me the courage, this very day, to say these are the ways I'm not being obedient, these are the ways I'm not believing his word, these are the ways I've been lazy instead of intentional about following after him. Well, if I'm not putting it all on my badness and oh, woe is me, I'm so horrible. Instead, god remembers Sarah. He remembered her as being good. Maybe he could remember me as being faithful.
Speaker 2:That makes it so much easier, so much more motivation to just take those next steps.
Speaker 1:That is so great. And as a Enneagram six and as one that has a chorus of criticism happening all the time, a committee of criticism and giving them so much of a voice in my day to day, I think what the Lord is just moving in my heart to do, just even in this moment, is as I hear them throughout the day saying you didn't do that right, or remember when you did this wrong, or, and really y'all it is that's. That's the reality of what goes on in my head day to day to day. Um, it's just to say no, um, I am loved and looked at by God and I am seen and remembered as faithful as I lean into him on a daily basis, even in my disobedience, my brokenness.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, and if there's one, you know God we learned this from Gomer God doesn't. He doesn't flatter us or or or refuse to tell us the truth about our sin. He's very honest. But when God gives correction, when he says you're not doing this right, it is always with an attached but this is where we go from here. We're not staying here because this is actually who you are and there's always hope. So if the voices in your head are just pushing you down and telling you're doing it wrong, with no hopeful place to go with it, it's not him that is so good.
Speaker 2:Jamie, and that's just. I mean, if you, all of the scripture teaches that, yeah, so he's not the God, who's who's going to say, oh, you're fine as you are. You just keep wallowing in that he's not that God. But neither is he the God that says you're always bad, you're only, you're a lost cause. I give up on you, absolutely not. So we got to take the correction with the hope of of of what he's called us to be and who we are, and he sees us outside of time in that.
Speaker 1:So, like it's already done, that's so crazy, y'all, if you're listening and you're having an aha moment, like I really did.
Speaker 1:We so did it. If you're having an aha plan I mean aha moment like that, like I am right now, and you're really bogged down because you're right those negative thoughts keep you stuck and it's doing exactly. What Satan wants to do is to just keep you in the status quo and not have you move forward in hope with the Lord. But if you feel stuck in those moments, we pray that the Lord will cover you with his love and grace right now and that you will be able to discern the difference between your voice and what the Lord is and and know that he is a lifter of your head and he's not a shame. Filled God and um. May that give us freedom and hope for today to be able to to move beyond that in the strength of the Lord. Yes.
Speaker 2:Amen, because we can't see the end of the picture. But we know today, we know what, right now, the very next thing to do, that's so good.
Speaker 1:So what's your next thing? I've been reading a book about it's called Getting Out of Bed by Alan Noble, and he is a professor at OBU and was actually my son's professor and my son worked for him for a little bit. But he has this book that is so good about mental illness and infusing it alongside God, and I'm not saying if you think those things, you have mental illness.
Speaker 1:But in my own struggle with anxiety. It is a constant struggle that I am having to rise above in the strength of the Lord and move forward in the strength of the Lord. But it is such a great book and he was just talking about you need to just get out of bed and do the next thing, get out of bed and do the next thing, get out of bed and do the next thing. And I just love how God is a thematic teacher, because even this conversation that we're having overlays into the book that I'm reading right now and he's so sweet to do that Well, and that's part of just for you and I, just our conversations that we're inviting other people into.
Speaker 2:You know, a year ago it was I think it was October when we did Sarah really talking about her. That day had a whole new meaning for me in that time. And that's the thing. God's Word is so alive. He is so with us. He's with us in our friendships and relationships. He's with us in His Word and you just never. That's why we stay in it. That's why we stay together with one another and in His Word, because you never know when he's going to bring that, to give you that next Something to learn, something to live out, something to teach.
Speaker 1:That's so good. Yeah, it's all there. Well, that's a great way to tie up a bow on the Old Testament there it is With Sarah, it really is. With Sarah. I know it's just such a poetic ending.
Speaker 2:I wanted to talk about Deborah.
Speaker 1:She's my favorite. I just love the poetry there of ending with someone that you weren't too favorite fan of.
Speaker 2:She scares. She scared me a lot, yeah, but you can go back and listen to Sarah if you want my thoughts on Sarah. Exactly, exactly. It was a heart, it was a journey, yeah.
Speaker 1:It's it just.
Speaker 1:I just am grateful we're rolling up our sleeves yeah, Not only in the Bible but in our own lives and being able to see what God has for us there, Absolutely.
Speaker 1:So we have created for you as we are kind of tying up our Old Testament women and 18 of them we have created for you a discussion guide, PDF, kind of a supplement booklet that will be in the show notes of this episode, in which you can just download for free and print it off.
Speaker 1:My mom is actually taking at her church her Sunday school class through these women that's so humbling and sweet to me, I know and so she's printing off this book for them and they're just going to meander through these women as long as it takes, and using our podcast during the week as a supplement to that and then having conversation in Sunday school on those women. So good, If you don't have a group to go with or do this with and don't want to gather up friends or don't really have the access to gather up friends on the daily, in your home, you can, or at church you can do this in a personal journey. So you can download and print this PDF that has a compilation of all the discussion guides, all the discussion questions that Jamie wrote for every woman are all compiled within this one supplement.
Speaker 2:Well, I love that too, because you've also added the three definitions or the three things about each woman, so that I've loved going back and looking at the discussion guide to remember how those guided our conversations as well.
Speaker 1:It's so true. It just brings them alive. You did such a good job putting that together.
Speaker 2:I love it, thank you.
Speaker 1:It's a good resource. It is a great resource that y'all can use and if you don't have a group, you can also do it individually as a journal between you and the Lord in conversations, and get a journal out and then record through all those questions. Just in a personal way. I think can also be used Sometimes.
Speaker 2:I know when I was in charge of teaching Bible study there were always gaps based around the discipleship schedule at church. So using that discussion guide and podcast would be great for some of the in-between gaps. That's true. To stay in his word and a committed basis.
Speaker 1:There's also a chart, a updated chart that probably is the one that's locked in stone now because we're done with the 18 women, but it has the, the order, biblical order in which they come in, and then the episode order in which we have, as well as their name and the biblical text, and so it's all there in one sheet, so you can see biblically where it goes.
Speaker 2:And that's good, because we changed kind of the order. We got started and then decided we wanted to add more. So you've got that all organized so that's there for you.
Speaker 1:Click on it and download it and then print it as you need to. So we will be heading into the New Testament women and we're going to be heading into the first one shortly and we'll release that in a couple of weeks. But we wanted to take this time to get the in-between because there was a 400 year span in between Malachi and Matthew in which they're they call it the intertestamental, which is the in-between, the testaments but it's also known as the 400 years of silence. Yes, and we're going to call it the in-between.
Speaker 2:I like it. Yes, the in-between. So now I have to say intertestamentals. Seriously, I cannot do that over and over.
Speaker 1:So the in-between time of the old and the new Testament, there were about 400 years of that. A lot of things happened that set us up to create a historical context in which we will investigate and be curious and get to know the new testament, women. But then also, it's just so fascinating to see, even though they call it the 400 years of silence, because there was no word, direct word from god, no word for God, no prophet speaking in that time, it didn't mean that he was inactive oh, that's right. And he was working, that's the main point to remember.
Speaker 1:Yes, and that is a fire truck, y'all.
Speaker 1:We are literally, we are in our car, my car, and there is a fire truck that went by. So that was that noise. So some interesting things about this period of silence is that silence does not mean inactivity, which I just referred to. God during this time is actually getting things ready for Jesus and the events that will change human history. God's silence was a part of his eternal plan. He didn't just say, oh wait, let me figure out what I'm going to do next. It was all a part of it and this period prepared the way for Jesus.
Speaker 1:Y'all, silence is often preparation. Yes. So if you feel that's a big one, that you are in the in-between of something and I started to think what are some of the in-between of something? And I started to think what are some of the in-betweens like pregnancy, you're in the in-between of having the baby come, maybe you're in the in-between of moving. That's hard, that's hard and it feels like there's silence in your story or from God. God is still working. It does not mean inactivity and he is preparing something. If you feel like you're in the in-between of parenting and potty training, y'all that was so painful of trying to get your kid out of these diapers.
Speaker 1:It's preparation for you as a mom, preparation, obviously, for your kid If you're in the in-between of healing, which, jamie, I know that you all are in.
Speaker 2:Yes, we are right there.
Speaker 1:That it is preparation for what God is doing. That's right. So I just want to encourage all of you listening that we too are on this journey with the Lord and feel like we're in the in-between so often. But remember, it's not his inactivity and oftentimes it is his preparation. It's not rejection.
Speaker 2:It is not rejection, it's not silence feels like rejection it does how. Why does it feel that way? Just because we're not getting immediate input and immediate confirmation and immediate instruction and all of that. That that's right. Yeah, I think we just we want that constancy.
Speaker 1:We do, and so in this preparation. Let's kind of dig into that for just a moment. In the preparation of this in-between time that God has in between the Old and the New Testament, jamie, what are some important impacts that this period had on Jewish life, which then in turn, impacts the women that we're going to talk about in the New Testament?
Speaker 2:And that's important to kind of touch on this history, because by the time Matthew opens up and we're starting into birth narratives about Jesus, we have this whole new culture. And it's funny because if you've been in church at any time, you know the New Testament stories were like oh yeah, the Romans. We hate those guys, but where did they come from? How did that happen? What you know? So both the religious setting and the political setting have a huge impact on the women in our story. And so knowing how the Romans came to power during that time, kind of what that how the history came through there, and then it's not just the Romans, the Romans are the political power and they don't care about God Most of them don't care about God. But then we also have a political range of their spiritual life. So the Jewish ruling group during that time, the Pharisees, some of the Sadducees, there's the scribes, all of that.
Speaker 2:And you, you hear that you guys like, as soon as I say that you're like, oh yeah, they're in the new Testament stories, I think understanding some of where that came from.
Speaker 2:And and this is not necessarily I don't know that everyone would agree with me about this, but I think when you look at the loss of of Israel, israel and Judah's loss from the old Testament of their monarchy, of their temple, of their oneness in their land. They lose all of that from the end of the Old Testament or not from the end, but during the course of the end of the Old Testament, to where they come. So I think a big thing that defines them all the way from the early 500s on, when they start, when we start the exiles, is that they're losing their identity or they're they're being challenged to keep their identity. They're losing so much of who they are, where they worshiped what God has called them to do. And I think sometimes, when I look at the Pharisees of the New Testament, you know they added there were 613, I think, laws that God had given and they had, they had thousands.
Speaker 2:And this we know this, when Jesus comes on the scene in the Sermon on the Mount, and so much of his teaching is, you've heard it said, but I'm telling you, and he's, he's saying let's get away from just the religious outer part to the inner part of what it means to belong to God and, I think, the building of that. They were so afraid again of losing their identity by being disobedient that they swung so far in the opposite direction that now they've lost that core of what it means to belong to God, to follow him, to be listening for him. And that's one of the biggest challenges, I think, in the New Testament and with the arrival of Jesus. And so that's what the women of the biggest challenges, I think, in the New Testament and with the arrival of Jesus. And so that's what the women of the New Testament, all of their stories will be completely bound to the person, the life, the death, the resurrection of Jesus. That's what we're going to be talking about.
Speaker 1:Yay, isn't that right, I know.
Speaker 2:But I think, as they're coming in, politically they have the Romans, which are harsh overseers, but also politically and spiritually they have a Jewish life. That is very demanding.
Speaker 1:Yes, and so that's, that's what I think that's.
Speaker 2:I think where, where we're kind of going.
Speaker 1:So, as I was thinking about the timeline in which we, as Americans, have been in existence 1776 to now is almost 250 years. The cultural changes, the political changes that have happened over this season of, so you double that almost yeah, I mean yes, and so the 400 years is massive yeah of all these movements that have been happening.
Speaker 2:Well, that's true. And in the new testament, what we're about, the 18 women we're about to talk about, we'll, only we'll. We'll follow less than 100 years of theirs in those stories, and we've had thousands that we've talked about with our old ladies, and so we've seen.
Speaker 2:We've seen so much change. And so now you know, I always think my favorite Christmas verse, galatians four four, says when the fullness of time had come. I mean, like what you said in our introduction, god is bringing it, it's full circle and now we're going to get to camp there for a little bit, but that 400 years of silence was a long time. You're right, it's a long time.
Speaker 1:And a lot of changes and shifts and just to go back, and really there's so many, there's so much history and detail within this time that you can just Google intertestamental period and it'll pop up for you with all the movements and all the historical changes and things. But just generally it was the persians that had a rule, political rule over the jews left off with esther, yes that's where we left off with the persians, and then the greeks came in, and then we have the roman rule.
Speaker 1:Are the general big dogs that were taking over and that each empire imposed their own systems of government, of rules and of cultural norms, and none of them were God fearing.
Speaker 2:Exactly, it clashed with the Jewish way of thinking, I think some were more friendly than others. Obviously, the Syrians and the Babylonians were really harsh. The Persians were less harsh. Let them at least kind of go home. Greeks were okay, and the thing about the time of the Greeks is it was Cultural growth and intellectual growth that had to have been paving the way as well.
Speaker 1:Absolutely, and that was one of the things that I read.
Speaker 2:It's called the Hellenization period and it was Greek literature and language and art and philosophy and education over that time and our women probably wouldn't have had direct access to all of that, but they would have because their culture was affected by it.
Speaker 1:They would have been Exactly, and it just began would have been Exactly, and it just began bleeding into all the culture. And it, like you were talking about, the Jewish identity kind of got a little muted with the infiltration of all these ideas, and the scriptures was translated into Greek and so they had a lot more people reading God's word. Oh, that is very important.
Speaker 1:Yeah, very important, and so it spread not only the understanding and knowledge of God, but it probably uh, diluted the messaging of it from the people that it impacted. I mean, it's all what needed to happen. And that's, it's setting the stage for a necessity of Jesus to come and write all the crazies that we spend off from that. But I thought that that was really really interesting.
Speaker 2:Well, and even the, the creation of the written scripture, would have come, at least in part, because that that had happened.
Speaker 1:But that's one reason why we have the old Testament in hebrew and the new testament is in greek is because of the greeks influence at this time.
Speaker 2:That's right. That's what the people in the land where they lived were speaking and writing okay, this is the last thing that I kind of want to talk about.
Speaker 1:Through this time, and probably with the influence of the pharisees and just how many rules, it was like a right, wrong, wrong. It was a good, bad it was a, an honor shame culture. And so if you do the right things, you're honored, and if you do the wrong things, you're shamed, and shame is such a deep identity of you are not good as a person, you're not valued as your behaviors don't reflect what you should be doing, and so it was a real condemnation that for the women, their rights and protections were tied so often to their status as a family, and so if they were barren and couldn't get pregnant, that was shame to the family. It was not honor if they could have lots of kids, and we see that still. We saw that at the honor.
Speaker 1:Shame with Leah and Rachel, but it's been even more firmly established, exactly as the Pharisees came in and added all these laws that you had to abide by, and so that's something to really look at. All of the women that we're talking about.
Speaker 1:there is a level of shame in which Jesus comes in and lifts their head with grace and teaches them and tells them of the love and the honor God honors Jesus, honors women all throughout the Old Testament, and that was one of the major paradigm shifts that we see in how he treated women, because that's not how they were treated in their religious settings and in their culture.
Speaker 1:Well, when we read those, those parts of the story in the New Testament we're like, of course you know we sometimes miss how counter cultural that would have been at the time, and so we just wanted to take an episode and just talk and share and set the stage yes, not only looking back in in gratitude for what he has taught us with the old Testament women but to settle in this in between and then to also look forward to what he's going to do in the New Testament with these women.
Speaker 1:And really, if you are in the in-between of your own life, may this be an encouragement to you that God is not inactive, that's right. He is working, yes. And for you to realize that in the silence, he often is preparing you the setting. It may not just be you, you may be ready, but maybe it's another person coming into your life, maybe it's putting pieces into place of opportunities and settings and situations that you will step into. That's right. And so I just think that we can be encouraged if we are in the unknown in between seasons and know that God is in it with us and he's working and recognizing that his silence is not rejection but it's preparation.
Speaker 2:He's close. You don't yell at people that you're right next to. He's right there. He's whispering his encouragement, he's. He's giving you all kinds of opportunity to keep learning about him and following him. So get in the word. If you're in an in-between, stay in the word. Stay in there with his people, because you don't know what's coming. You don't know what's coming and whatever it is, he'll be with you in it. Man, these are the days, the days of the in-between. In those preparation times can be very, very precious.
Speaker 1:And I know that you speak from real life.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm seeing some of the fruit of that now, absolutely Of the way that there's things that you don't. When you're in the middle of a crisis, you don't have time to prepare. So what's going to come out of you and out of your life is what you already put in there, and he's enough in those, uh, because he's with you. But, man, what a joy it is to be able to have some, some quiet time, to be able to stay in his word and and find that peaceful place because he is doing a work and it is fascinating to me as I look back at the various in-betweens in which I was so frustrated.
Speaker 2:Yes, why isn't he doing something?
Speaker 1:I know, but I was leaning into him, into him and his word and his spirit, with, I mean, just gritted teeth. Often I look back and when he did open up doors for me, I see how I had changed. Yes, because of the work that he had done in the in-between, the breaking, the humbling.
Speaker 2:Yep, you didn't even know you were ready for it.
Speaker 1:I didn't even know he he did, he did and he is so good and he's doing that in your lives too, and it will never be what we expect it won't.
Speaker 2:It is never. We expect it's so true lesson it's the detour that's so true, never the destination, it's. It's staying with him in the journey, every day, every single day.
Speaker 1:So we pray that this conversation landed on soft places for you and that you are encouraged and realize that you're not alone, because that's our hope for this podcast is so that you'll know that you're not alone and that God is always working, absolutely so. We look forward to taking this journey with you, and we will see you next time on the Card Chat Podcast. Can't wait.
